Monitor L rims

[joe herman]

I am going to be making some Monitor L and Dempster # 14 wheel rims when the weather warms up.
My question regards the slots for the sails.Is it better to have them fit tight or loose? If loose what would
be considered too much?
Joe

[Mike Hage]

Well Joe since you are making some of them for me I'd kinda like them to be snug. However I have heard. That it's best to paint them really good before we put them together. Too tight might be impossible to assemble. Any wisdom anyone??

[hwy8]

IMO, the fit needs to take into account the shrinking and swelling of the wood, especially the swelling which can cause the sail slots in the cross pieces to crack and break. My experience has been mainly with Duplex open wheels but I'm rebuilding two "L's" and the fans are all similar.The originals that I have had/seen were carefully cut and there was just enough room for expansion and contraction of both the cross pieces and the fan blades. Also, the originals each had a nail going through both the crosspieces and the fan blades. I've noticed some restoration guys are using stainless steel screws which will also strengthen the cross pieces and will come out easier if needed. Be aware that the fan blades MUST be drilled or they will surely split over time.

Although my new projects are just spinners, I want them to be sturdy enough to spend some serious time running in moderate winds. I've been considering cutting my slots as carefully as I can and then "glue" the blades in place with a thin bit of GE silicone. My logic is that it will keep the moisture out and provide just enough "give" during season/weather changes. I'd still use a fastener to anchor the blade like the factory did.

Burt

[Kansas Rust Buzzard]

I have done a lot of them, I like a good solid press fit, if your using cypress it shouldn't split if it swells and I like it sanded to push it hard. I think the real secret is sealing it up so it doesn't get rot in the slot as that is what I see in most failures. Think of it like a tooth, you get a cavity and it just gets bigger and bigger until there is a failure. If you paint the sails first, that is fine but you rarely see sails rot, is the rough slot your saw cut in the rim that gives out and painting it is very difficult. I went around buying up all the old lead paint I could find and that makes the best blades but its getting hard to find as most companies stopped in 1978 or about then. Now I spray a good coat of high quality oil based primer on them, then dip in a vat of Sherwin Williams oil paint, I put a wire on the narrow end, pull it out and hang, then use a good brush to break the viscosity. Depending on how well you brush, in a few days or week you can dip again until your heart is content. I hang them all and let them dry good and then spray one top coat on to soften the brush marks. What this does is get everything coated good, and seals all your cracks up completely. I would say it doubles the life of the blades in my climate but it takes a lot of paint. Its a messy job and takes up a lot of room plus dipping and hanging a wet blade is hard on the back. Others might have a way that works for them but this is what I do.

[Mike Hage]

We are going to use sipo for the rims and I'm gonna try 5 ply 1/4" Baltic birch for the sails. I'm hoping they don't really swell much. I guess if I do a good paint job it should be sealed??

[Mike Hage]

Joe I got thinking about what hwy8 said about drilling and putting a small screw in to hold the sails. Boy a guy will have to be really careful to not split the rims in between the slots. They did have a nail originally. I wonder if you could get away with just gluing them in? Adhesives have come a long way in 100yrs. Thoughts anyone?

[Windcatcher530 Dan]

What I've done on some projects that I wanted to put back original was pree drill the nail holes smaller than the nail holes to stop the splitting. It's teadious and time consuming but I've had luck with this process. A small nail punch helps too.

[Wayne]

The thing about glue is if you only loose one or two blades you can't just replace them easily. I use counter sunk screws, I use two drills one with a pilot bit and a counter sink, so I can pilot drill all my holes and counter sink at the same time. Haven't ever had a problem spliting a blade.

[joe herman]

Looks like there is no 100% sure fired way of doing these sails.MikeIi think I am going to cut the slots just a hair wider than the plywood.
That way there will be space for primer to get in.I know having them fit perfectly tight is satisfying in how it looks .
When I did my last wheel I applied heavy dose of green wood preservative in the slots before installing the sails.

I was going to set up my gig this week but mother nature dumped a pile of snow yesterday and maybe more to come.
I had just put up a 12 ft by 20 ft Shelter Logic Garage -in-a-box so would have a nice big space to work in.No room in my shop.

When I assembled a couple of Monitor L wheels in the past I predrilled undersized holes before driving in the nails.Used coated
nails not galvanized.Was told galvanized would more likely to cause splitting.
Joe

[Mike Hage]

Probably a good idea Joe. What kind of a hair? There you go you got the snow you wanted. I'm not able to do much out here either it's snowing and wet and windy and cold. I'm out of firewood gonna have to start burning the tables and chairs soon. That hub for your power mill is still under a 6 foot snowbank. Winter is holding on with everything it's got