Sears and Roebuck Champion (Stover): Project lost cause

[windybob]

That's okay. That's 10 foot windmill territory at 135 ft. If that is to the top of the water.

[TomsWaterPumper]

If the wheel is indeed 10 ft, I have nothing for parts. we have no 10 ft mills here.

Thanks for the help!

The wheel is definitely 10ft, the dog and I measured it, missing the spokes through

Sure would be nice to find a crank gear, to replace the cracked/broken one.

Lots of cast can be welded. I have welded many gears. Pitmans, maybe you can make some...

I've not welded cast, myself, have always avoided it. That half moon crack is pretty bad, there's another one adjacent that runs to the minor diameter 'valley' of a gear tooth, and has viably opened up .015" or so.. vee it out with a grinder, pre-heat and stick weld with that special rod made for cast iron, dress off the valley, cross your fingers?

The case web where the crank gear shaft goes thru is cracked? ... I don't see any pinion gears. ( small ones)...

Sorry for not being very clear. No cracks there, which I call the trunion block. The crank gear bearing, or cast iron bore inside the trunion block, is pretty worn. maybe the shaft is worn as well, I'll have to see when I get it apart.

The good news is that crank gear shaft rotates as much as there is clearance between the pinion gears, present and accounted for, it's not frozen. The two crank gears don't seem stuck on their shaft, either. There's only cotter pins holding them onto the shaft, I guess this makes sense now that I think about it, there's almost no rotational forces between the shaft and crank gears. They have a small amount of rotation (with respect to each other) on the shaft, allowed by cotter pin clearance i suppose, which means the crank gears aren't frozen onto the shaft. It should come apart wo/cutting it in half, but the shaft still may be junk because of the heavy trunion block bearing wear.

There are numbers all over the cast parts. SIze of mill, and part number. The 6 footers start with 6, and 8 footers start with 8. I will suppose for now yours start with 10? That means a 10 ft mill.

I'll check it out, and post a pic of the casting numbers. It's hard to gauge scale from pictures, mine's a pretty big chunk, maybe 120lbs. I'll take some measurements too.

SO that may be why the back of your mill looks odd to me. If it's a 10 ft, it may be made different than i'm used to.

I couldn't find any pics either, similar, but the hubs are different, most everything I saw in my internet search was listed as 8ft

more latter

[PaulV]

Per Windy's request, topics are now merged.

[windybob]

Thanks Paul. Today is a complicated day here, will get back later.

[TomsWaterPumper]

Cast in p/n IRT10

Some measurements for size comparison

10" x 16-1/2"
over all length, back of case to nose of small hub = 29"

[windybob]

I still recommend going with a later model mill to pump with. Like maybe a B702 Aermotor. There should be plenty of those around, and easier to build if it needs.

[TomsWaterPumper]

I still recommend going with a later model mill to pump with. Like maybe a B702 Aermotor. There should be plenty of those around, and easier to build if it needs.

The property I'm putting a windmill on is 37 acres of hilly high desert, 4100ft elev. I've got an electric pump and new well for the home and shop we are putting in. Adding a windmill is a little like 'creating a solution for a problem I don't have'.

No field to irrigate, no plans for livestock to water. My wife and I are mainly after the aesthetic, but I figured so long as I'm putting up a piece of farm history, it should pump water, maybe into a stock tank for the local deer and wild donkeys.

If you grew up on a farm, you might not understand my mindset, but there it is.

I've got the skills to precision bore and re-sleeve plain bearings, 4 yr machinist apprenticeship and 10yrs as a journeyman under my belt, access to a lathe and mill. Thankfully our kids are all grown and have few daily chores, but I work full-time plus, and have a ton of other projects/hobbies, so there's that.

[windybob]

I do appreciate your mindset. I used to live in the country, and half my customers value windmills as we do, because they are farm folks also. I have a total appreciation of the sometimes, cursed, sometimes valued machine. It IS the item that 'won the west' because nothing lives with no water. so, no rifle, pistol, or machine can compete with the windmill for historic and life-changing ability. ( okay, off my soap box now.)

Yes, you can rebuild the mill, and get it erected. It would even pump water, as you would like. ( many customers here have mills for wild life purposes. But remember, that in this sparsely populated area, any cattle tank is also a wildlife water tank. I don't know how many coons, possums, or other animals I've pulled from tanks. Lots of times I will toss in a board so they maybe won't drown.

We don't have many wild donkeys around here, but do have plenty of asses. But they have money too, so we work for them.

Keep us posted. Sorry I can't help on 10 ft parts, but others should because they were fairly common. Gee, where is Randy Stubbs when you really need him. LOL
Remember, these are slow-speed machines, and were mass-produced, and they are NOT the Mona Lisa, so there are things you can get by with that you can't on other things. (our little secret).

I interested to know if there are any types of bearings in the larger mills, as yours is. Do you have a tower?

[TomsWaterPumper]

I downloaded and read all the high resolution Stover literature from this site, what an awesome resource! Nice Job Paul.

My goal for now is to get it apart, to see what I've got.

I'll need a tower.

I spent a few hours on it this afternoon/ evening. I got the crank gears and short shaft out. That short shaft look to be hard-chromed, rotates in a plain bearing insert, separate from the mill's cast body. Interesting enough, that bearing insert is machined on an eccentric and held in place with a grub screw. At assembly, the mechanic rotates the bearing insert, which changes the center to center distance between the crank and pinion gears, until desired backlash is set. Then locks it in place with the grub screw. A nice arrangement. Pics to come.

Fortunately my neighbor came by, who is also mechanical, and offered to help with ideas and muscle. I live in the suburbs, many of my neighbors work in tech, don't even change their own oil in their cars. John hunts', fishes, and at 64yrs old still rides BMX, just taking 2nd at the northern California Championships, which I think is dam cool!

Although the main shaft is frozen in place on it's bearings, we were able to unscrew and remove the threaded on bell-shaped fan hub, the larger pre-load packing nut, and expose the nose bearing. We had to bust out the PB Blaster penetrating oil, an 8ft cheater bar, and oxy-acetelyne torch, but we got it done. Pics to come.

It’s a Timken bearing model, which is kinda cool. According to the literature, the Timken or Hyatt bearing models sold for a premium.

I'm able to get at the pinion support, and nose Timken bearings, and have them soaking in PB Blaster. I've heard a 50/50 mix of acetone and transmission oil works well, too.

[windybob]

Sounds very interesting ! Lots of different stuff on the larger mills than mine. (smaller)

Looking forward to pictures. Thanks in advance!

Hope all the fires will miss you (and everyone of course) and stay safe.