PROBLEM! Need advice of those who've been down this road a time or two...

[andrevh51@gmail.com]

All, thanks for reading. I'm having issues with my rod pump set up and I'd love some opinions on why i'm seeing premature failure in the parts i've installed. My system is as follows.

A montgomery ward reciprocating rod pump
260' rod length
3/8" NPT galv push rods
1" NPT galv drop pipe
1 13/16" x 18" long 442 MAAS Midwest water well cylinder pump
1" Simmons foot valve assembled directly to bottom of cylinder

Pressure switch set to 55 PSI Cut out.(This is the Max pressure check valve/leathers ever sees, in addition to the hydrostatic head pressure which is constant. ) (110 PSI head + 55 max cut out = total 165) Am I destroying the checks/leathers by overpressuring?

The issue is intermittent pumping of air. When the pump stops, air bubbles can be heard taking the annulus up to the top, as water can be heard falling down the drop pipe. This creates an air pocket in the line, which upon next startup is purged into the tank, thus eventually air logging the tank. Once the system purges most of the air out, it pumps ok, but not as good as it did 3 months ago. Cylinder and check valve were brand new Memorial day weekend, and all of a sudden last week i noticed severe and rather quick air logging of tank. Air comes up with water almost the entire time its pumping. Are my plunger leathers wore out, or the check valve(s) completely wore out? I have a hard time believing that within 3 months of moderate use two check valves would leak by bad enough to cause an issue.

Thanks for your input

[Wayne]

I would think if your valve leathers were wore out it wouldn't move water at all. I can't see how wore pump leathers could let air into the line. Where would it be coming from? Seems to me it would have to be something on the top end. Maybe Ron will see your post. He will probably have the answer.

[andrevh51@gmail.com]

thanks for your reply. my system has a set of leathers at the top of the rod string to essentially seal the top of the rods. these leathers seal only in one direction. with pressure up against the cup. if the check has failed, the water drains out and pulls air into the line. Or at least that is my best guess as to what is happening. I doubt i am sucking air at the cylinder, or depleting the well down that far. Im only moving one gallon a minute with this system the way it is set up.

[Ron Stauffer]

There should also be a check valve off the discharge of the working head and the pressure tank? Back in the day these were set up with 20-40 switches. These type systems were very short lived because pumps come on board and were way more reliable. So I have to ask why it was set up?

Head and psi are a function of each. A system psi of 55 equals 127' of head plus the potential of the 260' lift .can take you close to 400' of head which is a lot for a 2 leather shallow well pump. Your leak is likely the leathers at the working head provided there is a check between the working head and pressure tank. If there is a check,you can verify it is good by the gauge holding pressure when no water is used.

Ron Stauffer
Montrose CO

[andrevh51@gmail.com]

Ron, thank you for the reply. Yes, i’ve got a check between the discharge head and the tank. It holds pressure great. I also just completed a 48 hour prime test. Well holds prime just fine. My issue, as it remains, is limited output from the pump with intermittent air bubbles entering the tank. The pump also reacts by severly jumping on the down stroke. This almost would indicate to me that the plunger is encountering a void in the cylinder and then slamming into the water. AKA gas/air interference. When i pump slower it seems to alleviate the issue to a degree. clogged screen? The reason i set this up, is they want almost 30,000$ where im at for a new well. this is the only one i have and i had some fun with it. When it pumps decent, its a great source of water. with a brand new cylinder it does awesome. is there a cylinder with more leathers that would fit down a 2” casing? I was eyeing the maas midwest A -76 cylinder. they say it has 4 leathers. would that be more suitable for my deep application?

[Ron Stauffer]

Some questions to help analyze:
1) Static water level and possible drawdown?
2) Is the gravity bottom check supplied with 442 still in place as well as the Simmons check?
3) When you say prime, I assume you are filling the pipe and it holds but doesnt have system pressure? Priming level above working head?
4) If you open discharge before the pressure tank, does it behave the same? This could also test if have drawdown or pump dry
5) With a check before the pressure tank, the type tank should not be an issue. Bladder or steel with air regulator?

Ron