Baker AC Pitman Gear Stuck Tight

[billcobb]

I recently picked up a 1932 (patent date) Baker 8' AC. A few missing parts but not dead by any means. I can't rotate the Pitman gear at all. The connecting rod is free, the drive shaft gear is free. The Pitman arm is free.
But, the large gear is solid tight on it's shaft. Any thoughts on how to free it up ?

I have it soaking in diesel fuel right now. Before that I tried a little bit of heat but don't want to melt any bearing material. What should be my next move ? I was thinking of an acetylene cherry colored gear boss but I was wondering if there is some type of lockout spur in there that I've missed. I have the Pitman arm pin removed so that's how I know the arm and the connecting rod is free. The small drive gear is loose and engages the larger gear just fine.

Since the connecting rod is at bottom dead center, I can't pull any other parts out of the case.

[windybob]

The AC was made from 32 to 39. They are very similar, but not identical in make. There are things that will switch, and things that wont, so be sure if you need parts, you either have the stuff you need, or can get them. Don't think that a WC will fit all parts needed.

Ok. here's the story. These Monitors have no babbitt. They have a (half) circle ( not quite) brass insert in the snout, and at the end of the mainshaft. The bullgear is on a shaft, cast on steel, no bearing. In the back of the case you will see a setscrew on top of a hub. in the hub is a shaft flush with the backside. This shaft goes thru the bullgear. In the front of the case is a larger plug, and behind this hole lines up with the gear shaft. You can knock out the shaft from either side, but if it's rusted to the gear, (no bearing) needs to get loose first. If it has rust on it, you might knock the shaft out from the back to the front. It is a (half) press fit, so you don't need rust making it tighter on the way out. Soak it good, and keep tapping on the shaft. You might put the heat wrench on the gear around the shaft, and warm it, to help soak the oil in, but not too hot yet. The pitman stays in the gear until gear is removed.
Don't forget to soak the pinion. it is on the shaft with a half-moon key. There is a cotter and washer(s) on the backside of the pinion. hope it's not too tight, they can be murder if they are. Once the pinion is loose, you can pull the hub and shaft out. (hopefully)

There is an oiling ring on a bracket you can remove IF you take the rocker shaft out. This is a press fit! You can CRACK THE CASE if you are too rough with this shaft. Also, take out the oil pan/funnel (one screw). If the oil pan is broke off, it will be in the bottom of the case, happens all the time.

[Wayne]

I thought I read a thread where Ivan Block used water to free up rusted parts I also have a machinist friend who said he does the same thing. Didn't get how but am wondering if you heat it and then pour cold water on the parts to get a reaction. If I'm wrong don't call me stupid just misinformed. He-He

[CTXmiller]

Electrolysis?

[Jim Corcoran]

Regarding rust removal, perhaps this is what was refered to:

http://antique-engines.com/electrol.asp

Jim

[billcobb]

Got it ! Applied my magic Dark Matter solution of 50% acetone and 50% ATF from a Rural King squirt bottle into the pipe plugged access hole and at the Pitman gear shaft edge and waited a few minutes.

First there was 1/2 tooth movement, then 1 full tooth, then 2 teeth, then 1/4 turn then 1/2 turn. Reapplied the juice, rented a lager and then Bingo ! We have a winner. All the shafts and 'bearing's are in great shape. Hardly any lash or slop in the motion. Just waiting now to see if the Dark Matter dissolves the plastic squirt bottle.

Next: on to the mast pipe and straightening the sail spars.

[Mister Ed]

Good news. I was going to suggest something similar to your "magic Dark Matter". I use a lot of Ed's Red Bore Cleaner (different Ed) ... it is a 1:1:1:1 mix of ATF, acetone, kerosene and mineral spirits. Its a great penetrating solvent, does great at loosening old crunchy crusty grease, cheap enough you can afford to fill a gear box & let it soak, and it is a great bore cleaner too.

[windybob]

I like the part about renting the lager. I used to rent many a Miller's.

[Kansas Rust Buzzard]

I didn't see what Ivan wrote but I have actually freed windmills up by tossing them in the stock tank, it seemed to do best in 100plus summer days. When things are really bad and you can't hurt anything, I often sandblast a stuck head, then put it in a tank of diesel and warm it up good, hot diesel penetrates well. On small things I have had success with acetone mixed with brake fluid. Sometimes some acid is needed but you got to be careful. As of last year, I have started the reverse electrolysis. I started out freeing up old tools from auctions, then some dug up guns, I just kept doing bigger and bigger things, went from a small charger to a big charger to a DC welder. Its a pain to do big things but probably gets the best results with least chance of breaking. Good luck

[billcobb]

I'd say that the 'frozen parts in this Baker were not 'rusted' stuck, but glued by the deteriorated old-school oil that solidified and immobilized the gear. Because of the split bearing. the groove or channel inside the gear became a keyway for the oil to carbonize in. When the penetrants got in there to dissolve the crud, I got movement. The oiling trays in there were solidified oil residue (carbon). Must not have been using Mobil-1 back then in the 1930's. Save a few bucks and look what happens....

I doubt that a 'rust' removal technique would have helped in this case. Perhaps only by the action of the electrolyte solution.