Introduction

[hedgerow]

Nice looking windmill. Great Craftsmanship.

[Sidebikecomete]

Great Work a real craftsman. Were you a Mechanical Engineer by trade?

Hi Wayne
My job is CNC miller and i am just an amateur in welding en construction. Just a timekiller in the wintermonths.The drawing i made on the computer with an programming program for milling. But i now it wel enough to make a project on it

[Sidebikecomete]

Very nice duplication of an Aermotor style wheel under tension. You must have had one for a pattern?

If you post good pictures, I will look close. The wheel on the bench you made a common assembly mistake of not switching the starting point of the outer band when arriving back at the starting point. Overlap of the outer band in the 4 oclock position needs to lap the other way. You did good on the inner band overlaps. The pic of the finished product isnt good enough to see all the laps. Maybe you took note of that for the final assembly?

I am impressed with the one piece spoke braces on the inner bands but thinking getting spokes in position on the outer band would have been hard?

Ron Stauffer
Montrose CO

Hi Ron
The overlap are all good now, it was just tempuary to see if i bended the bands correctly
It was indeed hard to get everything together but i am just an amateur with a passion.

[windybob]

Feel free to share your works with us. Very exciting! I love it!

[Sidebikecomete]

Welcome to the group! I have found much knowledge and help here, just as I'm sure you will.

You do beautiful work and I will be especially interested in your vaneless project. Even though my background is in wind electrics, I have a long held interest in the vaneless Duplex mills and am beginning to restore a Baker "L". Both of those machines will just be running unloaded in my yard but I once saw a "modern" steel wheel, vaneless machine that had a design that might interest you. (I'm sorry to say that I do not remember the name and I didn't take pictures, but I know there will be someone in this group that can name the brand.)

Once you identify some vaneless machines that interest you (through a source like "A FIELD GUIDE TO AMERICAN WINDMILLS"), you might try the US Patent Office. The drawings attached to US patents can be very helpful and can sometimes be detailed as much as blueprints, and best of all, they can be downloaded free.

Downwind, vaneless machines are a beautiful thing to see operate (when running properly). They can govern really well and recover quickly without the shudder downwind electric generators can suffer from. Tower shadow on high speed rotors could cause problems and inefficiencies but with water-pumping windmills, the effect is not as great. I have spoken to a number of "old timers" living out in the high wind areas of the Great Plains and they would have ONLY a vaneless mill. HOWEVER, the large number of parts and the almost countless number of wearpoints have been the cause of many problems.

I'll be cheering you on!......

Burt

Hi Burt
I have tried to find vaneless windmill on the site of US patent office but I can’t find one. I don’t now how to search there. It doesn’t matter if it is a steel one or with wooden blades. I just need the dimensions and forms of the moving points. If you can find them I would be very interested in them.
Greetings
John (Dutch Miller)

[Wayne]

Hey John, A friend of mine, her family came to America from Holland in the late 1800's Does the names Friesland, West Frisian, Ingelum or in some places it is spelled Engelum or maybe Franeker mean anything to you. They are names of places she writes about in her book about her family. I love any ones family history so she has given me her book to read. I have the book by Dr. Baker (A Guide to United States Patent for Windmills and Wind Engines) one patent I just saw is number 904,106 Nov 17 1908 for vaneless windmillWE3 issued to Charles A. Whiting Waupun Wisc. That is where the Pipe Raymond was built. I'll do some more looking and see what I find.

[hwy8]

Welcome to the group! I have found much knowledge and help here, just as I'm sure you will.

You do beautiful work and I will be especially interested in your vaneless project. Even though my background is in wind electrics, I have a long held interest in the vaneless Duplex mills and am beginning to restore a Baker "L". Both of those machines will just be running unloaded in my yard but I once saw a "modern" steel wheel, vaneless machine that had a design that might interest you. (I'm sorry to say that I do not remember the name and I didn't take pictures, but I know there will be someone in this group that can name the brand.)

Once you identify some vaneless machines that interest you (through a source like "A FIELD GUIDE TO AMERICAN WINDMILLS"), you might try the US Patent Office. The drawings attached to US patents can be very helpful and can sometimes be detailed as much as blueprints, and best of all, they can be downloaded free.

Downwind, vaneless machines are a beautiful thing to see operate (when running properly). They can govern really well and recover quickly without the shudder downwind electric generators can suffer from. Tower shadow on high speed rotors could cause problems and inefficiencies but with water-pumping windmills, the effect is not as great. I have spoken to a number of "old timers" living out in the high wind areas of the Great Plains and they would have ONLY a vaneless mill. HOWEVER, the large number of parts and the almost countless number of wearpoints have been the cause of many problems.

I'll be cheering you on!......

Burt

Hi Burt
I have tried to find vaneless windmill on the site of US patent office but I can’t find one. I don’t now how to search there. It doesn’t matter if it is a steel one or with wooden blades. I just need the dimensions and forms of the moving points. If you can find them I would be very interested in them.
Greetings
John (Dutch Miller)

Hello John,

Find your way to Google Patents, "Search". I use "keyword" in most of my searches and in this case, I wrote "Vaneless windmill". Here's what came up.....In principle, this mechanism is like many vaneless mills. Personally, I find the text of patents to be far less useful than the drawings but it is the job of the patent attorney to protect as many ideas as possible. However, the patent illustrator/artist has the important role of drawing the mechanism but also demonstrating the function. Here are a couple of links:

https://patents.google.com/patent/US904 ... s+windmill

https://patents.google.com/patent/US607 ... 23&scholar

Hope it helps. If you begin to make and sell kits to be assembled, I'd buy one. It would be a wonderful thing for teaching.
Burt

[hwy8]

John,
I'm sending a screen shot: On the second link I sent to you, hit the "back to results" button (right beneath the words, "Google Patents")----it will take you to many other patents.....A very important feature is that you can use your cursor to hover over any of the illustrations to open it and use the zoom for enlargement. It will save you a lot time when looking for what you want!

Also, I'd suggest that you take this conversation into one of the topics in the Board Index: Many more people may see your questions and will be of great help to you....

Burt

[Wayne]

Hey Burt, Good Job. I've looked at patents by gong to the patent office web site. They certainly give you something to think about. Built an Aermotor wood tilting tower from looking at the patent.

[Wayne]

Oh yeah not a full size a scale model!